A Course Through Hell

Alan Watt on Marxism, Masonry, Top-Down Revolutionism & Controlled Oppositions

The following is a transcript from a 2007 conversation between the Scottish (Canadian-based) conspiracy researcher, Alan Watt, and Henrik Palmgren, of Red Ice Radio. The audio is here.

Alan Watt died in 2021. He was a prolific writer-researcher and radio speaker who generated hundreds of hours of audios which can be found at https://www.cuttingthroughthematrix.com/ While he was not a major influence on my own thinking (I only listened to him occasionally), I was struck in this interview, both by how far-reaching and nuanced his knowledge-base was, and how closely his perspective aligns with my own.

I can’t vouch for the accuracy of many of his statements (starting with the very first one about Marx), but at the very least, there is much fuel for contemplation and further research. I have bolded passages I consider especially interesting or relevant to current events.

Though Watts appeared a couple of times on Infowars, he was (and remains) largely unknown, even within the alternate research field (he has no wikipedia page, unlike, e.g., James Dellingpole); and while Red Ice Radio has undeniably become some sort of alt-right “limited hang-out,” and even back in 2007 it had a distinctly “2nd matrix” feel, it was still a valuable resource for researchers (I appeared in 2009 as Aeolus Kephas, here and here), and Henrik was a warm, intelligent, and humorous host (unlike the Nordic nationalist of 2025).

One thing I am confident in saying is that AW would never have fallen for the Donald Trump-Op, and this interview exemplifies the kind of deep background that used to be de rigueur for any serious conspiracy reseacher. RIP AW.

Complete Watt RIR appearances

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Palmgren: Karl Marx, Friedrich Engels: are these guys the real founders of communism?

Watt: No. We know that Karl Marx was a hack journalist who was kicked out of Germany and brought into Britain to basically write the manifesto. He was so unimportant that, for many years, his name wasn’t even attached to the first couple of editions. So he wasn’t the main thrust. He was the person who was told what to put into writing, into a formula and a theory, the whole theory of dialectical materialism, to make it into what seemed to be a science. That was what it was meant to be. It was to rival existing religions, by adopting the same sort of beliefs as religions run on.

In other words, the inevitability of what they call progress, and the rising of new forms, new ways of living from the lower classes’ struggle, supposedly. And with the decadence of the middle and upper classes, then you’d always have this fresh input for a new direction, coming from the workers. This was nice on paper, but it never happened in reality. It was a pseudo-science which tied in heavily with the writings of Charles Darwin. It was based on the Superman-type theory that, through science, through the abandonment of all religions, simply by using science, man would somehow fulfill a destiny. This shows you that there was a religious pull to their whole preaching of communism, that there was a destiny that they had to fulfill. [Hence the] many books.

You’ll find that all the Masonic, Freemasonic groups of the day were heavily involved in the revolutions, which predated Karl Marx. You can go back to the English revolution. That was the first major turn where bankers financed Cromwell to take over England and get what they called democracy. The second revolution was the American Revolution, and that was followed by the French Revolution. Freemasonic literature, even today, openly declares that they have been behind every revolution for the last 500 years.

Palmgren: Regarding Cromwell, what time period are we talking about?

Watt: You’re looking into the 1600s, and Cromwell was financed by bankers from Amsterdam, who financed his army, the equipment, the armaments, and all of that stuff to change England’s system from the feudal society to the next step, which was a form of democracy, even though initially it was all for nobility. They swapped their feudal system and gave themselves a parliament, you might say.

Palmgren: I guess we could tie this into William of Orange and the banking system coming out of the Netherlands.

Watt: You’ll find that even with the writings of Thomas More with his Utopia: he wrote Utopia about the same time [1516], or just before, Francis Bacon wrote his New Atlantis [published posthumously in 1627]. They’re very similar because they’re both Freemasonic writings or Rosicrucian writings. He talked about a future world where everything would be in its place and everything would have its place, run on a form of science, with lawyers at the top, administering the justice to the people. Science would lead the way out of the darkness of religion. From the 1500s onwards, you can see the start of this. And by New Atlantis, they meant the Americas.

Palmgren: One theme running throughout all of this is the Promethean character. Isn’t this right? The statue that is outside of the Rockefeller Plaza. This is basically the god who stole the fire from the other gods, right?

Watt: That’s right. Fire from heaven. Meaning intellect. There’s a good poem out there by Shelley on Prometheus. And Prometheus again in later religions became Satan. It’s the same hidden meaning behind all the religions. In fact, they’re all the same story. So Prometheus took light, intellect, to the world of darkness, and gave it to Man.

Palmgren: So he’s the rebel who defines the overlord, I guess. And the revolutionary idea is to always rebel against the authority. I guess they see it that they’re trying to rearrange the current paradigm by actually having people rebel or go into revolution?

Watt: Yeah. The whole idea of the mystery religions is to bring order out of chaos. They perceive a world where everyone does their own thing as chaos, as chaotic. They want a world run by science where science dictates to the people and the people follow and do what they’re told. This has been like that for at least 500 years. We see it today on television programs across the globe, even on regular newscasts: they always bring experts on to tell you what to do about this, that, or the other. You don’t have to think for yourself because they’re there to do it all.

That is what Bertrand Russell, a British lord, a hereditary lord, said, that we’re creating a world where the people will be unable to decide anything for themselves. They’ll simply follow the experts. And that’s the world, the utopia they’re talking about. That’s what they mean by order. The planned future.

Palmgren: Do you know anything about Guy Fawkes?

Watt: Guy Fawkes supposedly was brought in (many think) at the time because of the chaos that was reigning when James 1st of England came in. He was already the 6th of Scotland but the first for England. He needed an excuse to get taxpayers’ money to build his armies up. He couldn’t find them. And it was lucky that Guy Fawkes had been brought in on behalf of some of the Catholics (Fawkes had early Jesuit training). And somehow or another, they did catch him red-handed when he planted gunpowder underneath the Parliament building. So James became the victor and suddenly he was a hero and got all the tax money he wanted.

Palmgren: Do you know if this is related to the huge London fire that was reigning? I think it was, wasn’t it 1666?

Watt: At that time, Sir Christopher Wren and other architects, who were also Rosicrucians, very high-level Rosicrucians, just happened to have a new plan of London all drafted up, with new buildings. And, of course, that would have laid an idle if they didn’t have the fire. So it was very fortunate they had the fire to fulfill the dreams of rebuilding London as an international city.

[cf. Los Angeles 2025]

Palmgren: We can tie this into the fire-worship of Prometheus, and the idea of the sun worship, the fire that changes society to bring forth this new order. Do you know if, in other cities and so forth, there are major astronomical alignments going on and city planning and all this? Do you know of any of that going on in the city of London?

Watt: I’m sure it will be because these guys love it. They never change their methods. They always stick to the same methods.

[….]

Palmgren: Could there circulate ideas up there that, on these levels, of these people who actually are in the positions of power to build cities and so forth, that they actually are communicating in some sense with higher forces, with these kind of messages?

Watt: It could be a load of nonsense. Most of the stuff that comes out about these groups comes from these groups, and they always give us stuff to mystify us and intrigue us. Many of them have said, even about the Illuminati, that the best way to get people into the order is to put out mystery and intrigue. And the young go in, they want to know the secrets. So they put a lot of nonsense out there.¹

Palmgren: It’s a jungle, basically, a mishmash of all of these different ideas. And on one level, as you say, it’s very intriguing, very interesting. And also, I totally agree, it feels like it’s there to mesmerize you and get you into that kind of thinking with that kind of theme. I mean, do you go by heart or do you study this very meticulously in order to separate the truth from the lies?

Watt: You can definitely throw a lot of the mystery out the window. As I say, they put out about themselves generally to give themselves almost—it creates awe in the listener to think, “Oh, they’re so powerful and they have this magic,” etc. So you realize, no, they run mainly on science and money, of course, big money. And secrecy. And they are the only ones on the planet who are directing the course of the future of the planet.

So the lesser groups, the lower orders of Freemasonry, can really believe as they wish. I knew some of the middle members, like Maurice Strong, who was picked up by Rockefeller and has been a UN frontman ever since. I know that he has his personal deity that he meditates with. Now, how much of that is nonsense or is put on a show for the public? Once again, we don’t know.

Palmgren: Very interesting. It always seems to tie back to these entities that are being channeled or whatever. We could speak about Aleister Crowley and his Aiwazz, where you’ve got The Book of the Law. We could speak about Joseph Smith of the Mormons, who also had some kind of encounter with light beings or something.

Watt: And once again, Joseph Smith was a Mason. And fortunately, the angel let him translate it all. He gave him the power to translate it from the golden tablets, then took the tablets away so that there’s no proof. (Laughter)

Palmgren: Exactly. It’s beautiful. Yeah. You mentioned the Nazis, the Vril society, and I guess also the Christian society. There is this underlying thing that there was some kind of fight between the Nazi branches going up against Freemasonry and the fraternities that were in place in Europe throughout that time. Do you know if this is true?

Watt: This is a standard thing. The Soviets did the same thing. Once they get in power, they abolish all lower orders of Freemasonry because they, of all people, understand how Freemasonry has been used to foment revolution and counterrevolution. So they always abolish the lower orders.²

[c.f. Trump 2.0]

. . . . The Soviet regime is interesting. In the British newspapers, after they decided to take the wall down, because it was time to move out into society, according to the speech Gorbachev gave in the Soviet Union, a two-page spread was done on the Soviet general staff of the military, and they found that they were all into the same things, channeling, fortune-telling, talismans, all the old magic stuff. [Citation?]

Palmgren: So there is this underlying idea, the official version, that the Soviet or the communist socialistic idea was atheistic. But I think you pointed out in one of your blurbs that, again, this is a very religious movement. I guess, could we interpret something as if we look at the symbols on the old Soviet Union flag? The hammer and the sickle. What’s your take on that?

Watt: On the one hand, you’ve got the hammer, which is more of a Nordic symbol. Behind all these movements, you always have a Nordic influence. And so you have the hammer of Thor, and you also have the same hammer in the British societies that H.G. Wells belonged to, the Fabian Society, where you see in the stained glass windows for the Fabian Society, H.G. Wells and others, the founders, hammering the world with a big hammer. That was the same as the Soviets. You would use the hammer. The hammer, the might.

But they also have the sickle. The sickle is a standard tool that Kronos, Saturn, used, the scythe-wielder. He cut the cords between ages, the old and the new, so the scythe was a symbol of the cutting between the old and the new age. And also the moon, you see, the Nasi in Hebrew, means the head [as in chief, or prince]. It’s also for the new moon. The [prince of the] Sanhedrin is called the Nasi, which is quite the coincidence.

And between the two horns of the sickle or the moon, you also have a little star there, if you look closely. That again is a star of Lucifer, the lightbringer, or Prometheus, same old story. Highly occultic. All Masons and military organizations have a square where they march. And that’s from Freemasonry. And they call it square-bashing in Britain, where you learn the drill and do all your marching. And the Soviets had the red square, and red was the color in Freemasonry for revolution.

If you go to the British police, they wear checkered, black and white squares around their hats, because they are Freemasonic societies, they are the fraternity of Freemasonry. So there you have the black and white on the one side, where you have the red ones on the other, but they’re all part of the same structure. In fact, the Scottish branch of the military, around their hats, they have the red and white squares, because that comes from the old Jacobean part of their society. The Jacobean revolution. They don’t wear those same ones today, because Scots are always put out into the forefront as the shock troops for all the fighting. So they’ve got a lot in common with the symbology of the Soviet system.

Palmgren: There is one term that might also connect with the hammer, and this is the idea of beating your swords into plowshares. Have you heard about this?

Watt: Eventually, that was always their intention, but only after total dominance of the world is achieved, to ensure that Joe public could never have a counter-revolution. That’s what they mean by it.

Palmgren: So this is the idea of abolishing all weapons in the world after your structure is in place, basically.

Watt: Yes. In fact, communism used to say that the definition of their goal was the absence of all opposition. That was when they would achieve their goal. They used all the Masonic free symbols on the Soviet side as well. Leon Trotsky wrote about it when he was escorted out of Russia, through two or three different borders by Russian police, or NKVD, as they were called at the time. He said they didn’t have to show passports anywhere because his guides gave Masonic flashes as they went past and were allowed through. When he died, Trotsky was writing a book on Freemasonry. He joined Freemasonry while in prison. They were all Freemasons, on all sides. If you look into the United States Congressional Hall, you’ll see all the symbols of the old gods, the mythological gods of Greece, up on the ceiling. And if you go into the Kremlin, you’ll see the same thing.

Palmgren: The main idea now is that all of this goes back to Greece. Do you think that they, up there, tie this back further to Atlantis, as you spoke of earlier, considering the Francis Bacon idea of the New Atlantis?

Watt: Here’s something people don’t realize. It’s not too difficult to understand when you grasp the initial parts of it. You’re dealing with a system that plans the future always, and always did. How clever, to write your ending as the beginning of your holy books. We must remember that. There’s a lot of hidden allegories in Genesis, for instance, to give you the realization that they’re giving you the ending. They’re giving you it as the beginning, but it’s actually been reversed. Their goal is to recreate Adam and Eve in the one perfection of a deity, which is a hermaphrodite.

And if Adam was the perfect image, imago, of the deity—it’s a perfect sameness, that’s what it is in the Greek—and yet they took the female from Adam, meaning that he had male and female within him. That’s the part of the mystery religion. And what do we find today? The scientists are trying to create hermaphroditic beings for the future, which will be well-balanced, there’ll be no quarrels, no male-female anymore as such, and they can just clone more and more of them rather than have births for them. This is all part of stuff that’s been written down by high scientific groups. [Citation?]³

Palmgren: It’s a loop of history and mythology all mixed up, and they can not tie in the knots where they feel necessary, to keep the same game going over millennia.

Watt: And all we have by any other authors on Atlantis is the same little sketchy piece, where they mention that the Atlanteans were at war with the Greek colonies, and they were overrunning them and it was the Spartans who saved them. They defeated the Atlanteans, and as it was ending, then Atlantis sank. We don’t have any real stories except the ones that were invented in the 1700s, 1800s by Masons to talk about higher technologies. That’s when they put all these books out that had nothing to back them up. But the more they’re repeated, the more it seems true. Because that’s all we have on Atlantis.

And we do know that, if you go into the Mediterranean, the Aegean Sea, you’ll find that they’ve done tremendous excavations on the island of Tera, which is part of a ring of islands. And at one time, they were the outer ring of an island that did sink. We know that is true. We do know that the people who lived there, they were high merchants, they owned the ancient world’s merchant routes. And every room had hand-painted frescoes, ideal locations, beautiful temperatures. They were the high-class peoples of their day. We know that the middle of the island sunk, it was a volcano, and most of them did manage to abandon it, having plenty of warning that was happening. That seems to be where the story of Atlantis really came from.

Palmgren: And if we are to take the, story of Atlantis, and the mirror-loop idea about history and mythology, then the destruction of Atlantis, obviously, is going to be mirrored in the destruction of America, if that is the new Atlantis?

Watt: That’s right.

Palmgren: Since we began to talk about communism and socialism, I guess there is kind of a current ongoing invasion from South America into North America, to merge the whole continent and all of that. It might not have been Karl Marx who wrote this, but wasn’t this one of the ideas that was brought forth by Karl Marx?

Watt: He wrote that in Das Kapital. He said that a world would evolve, if they worked hard enough towards it, where they would have a united Europe. A united America and a far eastern conglomerate. It’s now called the Pacific Rim region. This was all worked out by the economists of the day. The big players like John Stuart Mill and others were all heavily involved in the planning of this. The bankers, the Rothschilds, were heavily involved in it, too. It was foreign policy, in fact, to them.

They have different special groups of high Freemasons, just like the monks. Freemasonry already existed within certain groups of monks down through the ages. And if you wanted to start your own order of monks, you’d have to get a charter, either from the group you were already in, or from the Vatican. You’d have ones who dealt with healing. Now, if you were into the translation of ancient languages, you would start your own order up and have a charter to do it, and then that order would specialize in ancient languages.

That’s the same way it still works today within high Freemasonry. So they give you the order called the Royal Institute of International Affairs, and the American branch is called the Council on Foreign Relations. They still don’t publish, mainly, their meetings to the public. And I’ve got a videotape where this guy’s introducing Brzezinski, and he says that this is one of the few publicly available broadcasts we’re giving out. Generally, he says, we don’t allow the public to hear our meetings.

So here, you find every politician who is worth his salt is a member. Every high journalist is a member. Every newspaper man is a member. Every high guy in the military is a member. It’s the whole system. They’re part of a secret society that claims it is non-governmental, and they don’t play politics. That is true. They make an agenda, and they follow that agenda. They don’t play politics. That’s a specialized branch of higher Masonry. The same thing as precursor was the group that Cecil Rhodes and Rothschild set up in Britain, which became the Round Table Group of Lord Alfred Milner. That merged with the Cecil Rhodes Society, and they became the Royal Institute of International Affairs, and they were given a British Crown Charter to exist, like a license. In a sense, working for the British government.

Palmgren: And people who got Rhodes scholarships, right? Like Clinton?

Watt: And now, of course, many politicians and bureaucrats of all countries are Rhodes scholars. They all go to Oxford for their training, then get sent back to their own countries. But they’re already sworn towards working selflessly towards world government.

Palmgren: How would you tie in people like Hugo Chavez in all of this? Any ideas on him?

Watt: Well, you almost always have your oppositions, or what appear to be oppositions. The public who are living in the bottom level of the matrix can clue in when they see a common enemy. One enemy. The business [? inaudible] is getting too big for their boots. So the trick has always been the dialectic: you always give an opposition to the enemy. Knowing the public then will take sides. Because in the mystical arts, you always need at least two sides to create conflict, and out of conflict, you guide the change. The synthesis. And that’s how this has been done for thousands of years.

In ancient times, they couched it in more mystical language, and they would say that summer combats winter, spring combats autumn. That had to be even more secret from the powers that ruled at that time. Today they’re more open about the technique, and probably Marxism came out more openly than any other group, by putting this technique down of the eternal struggle, eternal conflict to the ultimate goal.

In communism, you start off with your thesis, and that could be your front group causing pressure, knowing that, for every act, there’s an equal and opposite reaction. You then create the reaction to it, and you put your men in there for leaders. And then you have a synthesis, but it doesn’t stop there with the synthesis, which is compromise. You’ve now changed the system to a compromise. Then you take the synthesis, and that then becomes the new thesis, and then it has its antithesis, and then it becomes a synthesis again. It has to be never-ending, until they reach their final goal of creating Man as God. All going back to Charles Darwin again. Darwin, all he was doing was vocalizing his Masonic religion, because the Masonic religion had always believed in evolution. And that, with the use of science and understanding nature, they could speed the process up.

Palmgren: I guess we could tie all of this together again in with the current situation in North and South America, or America at large, regarding multiculturalism and how this is being used. Do you think this ultimately is something damaging? Is it also one of the things that are being played out, to advance the agenda?

Watt: Oh, there’s no doubt. Rockefeller gave a speech, and I have the video of it. It was taken internally at one of his meetings with his group of the CFR. Right there, they’re talking about this, and he says, “It’ll be unfortunate,” he said, “you can’t make an omelet without breaking eggs.” And then he said, “Unfortunately, this generation are the cannon fodder for the plan.” In other words, they know the chaos that will ensue as people battle to try and retain their cultures; and the animosity and hatred they will build up. But they will use all of that as a reason for coming down hard on everybody, into a totally planned, directed society. They will use that. So they’re intensifying it, in fact. [Citation? May refer to this]

You actually find that some of the groups that are coming up from Mexico, and have been taught to be really radically pure Mexican and “Mexico forever,” and reclaim their old territories, are being funded by the same Rockefeller foundations and Carnegie and Ford foundations. So these foundations, like Adam Weishaupt said, since they have unlimited financing, will control all conflicts by financing all sides.⁴

[…]

Palmgren: When will people wake up and realize what’s going on? Is it lost? If they’re implementing this stuff, this is contributing to the fact that people don’t have the strength, time or energy to actually look at this stuff.

Watt: Yes, that’s the problem. Plus, the generation now that is around 20-25, they have been more inoculated at an earlier age than any other group. And we know the effects of the mercury and all the rest of the stuff they inject. Everyone’s got immune system problems. Everybody today has it—that’s the new normal. And it’s because they were attacking our immune systems, not helping them.

Read the writings of the guy who invented the polio vaccine, Dr. Salk, who we all think is such a wonderful hero. I went into his history and found that he was one of the main spokesmen for the American Eugenics Society who wanted to drastically reduce the world’s population. That’s in the history books. And he comes out as your savior, supposedly. And since then, our IQ level drops, and we all have autoimmune problems. This was part of the agenda. I hate to say it, but it’s true. And so I think those who still retain memory and their intellect, we’re the last ones that can speak out to alter the direction of this. The up-and-coming group have been changing. They’re too heavily hit.

If you look at the writings of Arthur Koestler, he worked for the United Nations, in think tanks and laboratories, finding ways to chemically lobotomize the public for a world of peace. And I realized, my God, they’ve been doing it. They’ve actually been doing it. The World Health Organization is part of the United Nations. In the 50s, they openly came out (it is in the old newspapers and old books at the time), The World Health Organization, which I call Dr. WHO, they came out and advocated heavily lacing all the water supplies in Lebanon to bring down the aggression of the people. The benefactor, the United Nations.

Palmgren: It feels like it is to also get people totally dependent on taking drugs to actually live a decent normal life at this point.

Watt: Aldous Huxley was the main spokesman. The public broadcasting service here is running a three-part special on a promo of a series for television about the year 2020 or 2025, and they run on fictional forms, according to how society is going. And everyone on the planet in this series has brain chips. They take you through a guided tour of the future with the hologram of Aldous Huxley of Brave New World. And if you don’t take your chip, they call you a Luddite. So you’re fixed in time. You’re a caveman. This is what’s called predictive programming, making us think this is inevitable and we’ll just have to go along with it.

Palmgren: Because if this is the expected future, if young people are so conditioned into that, it will be nothing strange at all with that kind of behavior. That’s how we work, basically, as humans.

Watt: What they’re not telling you is, we have never lived in a perfect society. We’ve never lived in a society where you do not have a dominant minority who run things. Why would they give you access to a freedom? And of course, they’re not going to give you access to a freedom. Once everyone’s chipped, they might give you the occasional virtual reality movie in your head for a little while. But eventually, they’ll pull the main switch and then the real purpose will kick in and then they will arrive. They’ll have their utopia. When we’re all robots. That’s what their goal is.

History is a course through hell for people. And we haven’t suddenly become civilized.

Palmgren: In one sense, if we are to look at it from another perspective, this is an incredibly rich learning process in the sense that we get to know our dark sides very well during this process we’re going through here.

Watt: We’re all being conditioned. They promote this through movies and cartoons, and the youngsters want to be like their superheroes, and they’ll tell them they’ll get tremendous powers, and how exciting it will be. They’ve got movies out there already, and cartoons for children with that very thing, where their heroes have microchips in their brains. It’s conditioning the public to go along with this. However, for the adult population, they need strife. They need to get all the different races fighting each other. The chaos growing, the mass movements of peoples all over the world, and the chaos that will ensue, so they can point it out and say, “Hey, we can’t go on like this. We’ve got to get order. We’ve got to have peace and safety. We have the plans right here to do so.” First you create the problem, then offer the solution.

Palmgren: Do you think that this could be erupting at any point here, or is there some kind of big steps or big events that they have to get to before they actually implement the full chaos?

Watt: The problem is they have so many facets of the secret services in every country, which are all tied together at the top already, always have been; especially since the signing of the United Nations Charter and the NATO Charter. The CIA, Mossad, MI6, and every other group is tied together in compartments at the top. They have special groups that can create any kind of chaos and blame anybody. They have unlimited financing, they have experts to do the demolition jobs or whatever they choose. We already have exposés from Porton Down, warfare laboratories in Britain, that develop some of the most highly contagious forms of diseases, generally. They can take their pick because they have it all.

Palmgren: If we’re not fighting against mind control clones who are performing this kind of stuff, one of our goals to actually do something about this would be to wake up the people who actually are implementing these kinds of things, who are within these structures and these power, these organizations, as you mentioned.

Watt: Yes. You’d have to. The problem is: I watched a program a few years ago on the American nuclear submarines that were based in Scotland in the Holy Lock. And the commander of the base was asked how they picked the actual men who were trained just to work the keys and the programs for the release of the bombs, knowing it was the end of everything. And he said, quite matter-of-factly, “We have a special psychology test we give candidates for this particular job, and what we’re looking for are psychopathic personalities.”

Palmgren: (laughs) Oh my God.

Watt: And that’s what they’ve been doing with the scientists that work on this kind of stuff. It’s the same test they give them. They want psychopathic personalities who live on ego, who have no feelings for other people, and who are obedient only to their paymaster.

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1. Watt: We do know that some sects have used channeling, what we now call channeling, for centuries. It goes back to the ancient Greeks where their main oracles [were] women who were essentially drugged, who were supposedly in communicado with the gods. She would murmur something in a strange tongue or just a garble and the priest would interpret it. That was very common in the ancient world. It’s generally women they use for channeling, even Adolf Hitler, a couple of the societies that he had, the Vril society was one of them, they used a female channeler. And again, we don’t know how much is myth and how much is meant to fascinate us. But they do claim that some of their advanced technology was channeled through this woman for their weaponry.

2. Watt: However, while they’re in power, they keep the higher level to themselves, and they still practice it at the higher level. If you look at Himmler, Himmler had his own Masonic Knights Templars. He had his own Templar-type temple created and built. And he went by the old Templar plans with the round temple, or octagonal. I think some of them are octagonal. But he was heavily involved in this, more so than any of the rest of them. And we know that Adolf Hitler had his favorite channeler as well, and he also had a guy who did the stars for him, these horoscopes. So he was heavily influenced by all this, too.

3. Watt: Let’s go back again even to the same technique of putting the ending as the beginning. Plato studied in Egypt for years. That’s where he got his education. Once he got into the high degrees, he did a circular tour—they still do this today—and he went to what’s now called the Holy Land area to be initiated into other degrees. And then he went to India. So this is the same thing. India has always been a big player in all of this. A very quiet place, but a lot goes on there. And Plato, being a member of the mystery religion, knew this technique of giving you something that happened in the past as a story, when to the initiates, he’s telling what their ultimate goal was going to be, by giving a story as though it happened in the past. Even the name he gave for the predecessor in his family, he claims, and even that’s tongue in cheek. We don’t know if he was pretending. But he said his name was Solon. So Sol is the sun. And the Greek city, when they went into Egypt and dominated Egypt, their main city was Heliopolis or On in Egyptian. So it was the sun [or son] of On. So it’s tongue-in-cheek allegory in a story form for something which is to come.

4. Palmgren: So this is to bring in even more control. We spent another show previously talking about the microchip, but again, this is being implemented, as we speak.

Watt: I’ll tell you how it’s implemented. At Loyola University, where they’ve had the world meetings of science, sponsored by the US Department of Commerce, I have all of that material [citation?]. Six hundred pages came out of that meeting, and they said they have the chip ready to go, all they have to do is convince the public of the necessity of taking it. I was watching a professor at a university in Canada give a talk on the behavioral sciences. He’s a complete Huxleyan, this guy believes in the writings of Huxley, and he was going on about the techniques of mind control through drugs, through electromagnetic radiation. He didn’t mention HAARP, but that’s what HAARP does too, how it can pacify people and be used to control whole societies. As an actual fact, he wasn’t surmising this is something to come. He said this is all proven fact. So this stuff is being used on the public today as we go through these big changes. They could make the public edgy, they could make the public nervous, by a simple alteration of the frequency. Or they can make us very passive and willing to accept anything, if they wish to. So they’re using the HAARP technology in conjunction with the heavy aerial spraying, which is mainly metallic particles.

You probably heard of Nikola Tesla. There’s an awful lot of rubbish about Nikola Tesla. Nikola Tesla has been some sort of happy genius that wanted to benefit mankind. Tesla worked till the day he died trying to perfect energy plasma weapons that could wipe out whole cities. He worked mainly for the military. And he did come up with the standing wave technology, that’s now called HAARP. And the problem was that they couldn’t use it effectively at very, very long ranges, only in immediate vicinities. Now, of course, they can bounce it off the ionosphere. However, it was the inventor of the hydrogen bomb in the 50s, I think it was Heller, who came up with the idea of how to get around that, to use HAARP more effectively on whole continents or even the whole world. And he came up with the idea of heavily lacing the atmosphere from aircraft with metallic particles, which would make the atmosphere like a heavy circuit. And he could then use the HAARP technology to cover vast distances and regions, and influence the moods of the people. Well, they’re actually doing it. We’re going through it. It’s being done.